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Is their a case for flatting with KK instead of 4betting in certain games

  • 111Jackhammr318 (Westside, CA)

9 handed


Hero in SB with KcKs and $500

EP limps

Folds to Hero in SB who raises to $30

Folds to EP who 3bets to $90 with $300 behind

Range of EP:

QQ+, AK+ (21 combos)

If Hero 4bets all in EP will only continue with KK+ (7 combos)

EP will fold 14/21 combos, or 67% of the time

67% of the time Hero wins $127

33% of the time Hero is called and the pot would be $390x2 or $787

Hero's equity when called is 23%

Hero's ev would be:

1) EP folds 67% x ($127 + $470) = 67% x $597 = $400

2) EP calls 33% x ( (23% x$780) + $110 left) = 33% x $289 = $95

Total equity = $499 or -$1

How about if Hero flats for $60?

This would be $60/$300 or 20% of effective, so not typical calling criteria

But hero would be calling not to set mine, but to keep Villain's range wide, and to check/call or call two streets for value, and fold to more aggression unless hand improves

Hero's range against Villain's range if Hero calls is

KK versus QQ+, AK+

Hero has 57% equity going to the flop with a pot of $180

Your thoughts?

If Villain's range is wider, say JJ+, AQs+, AK, then Hero's ev if Hero 4bets would be: (assuming Villain only continues with KK+)

1) EP folds 24/31 or 77.5% x ($127 + $470) = 77.5% x $597 = $462

2) EP calls 22.5% x ( (23% x$780) + $110 left) = 22.5% x $289 = $65

Total equity = $527 or +$27

So maybe if Villain's 3bet range is wider than QQ+, AK+ then 4bet shove...or if Villain's 4bet calling range is wider than KK+ then definitely shove.

Many games I play the 4bet calling range is KK+

Another case would be against a hyper aggressive player who has a wide 3bet range but a tight 4bet calling range...and is aggressive post flop with light holdings...

Your thoughts?


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